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Swap shocks without a lift?

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20 May 2020 11:52 #222566 by Gadget
If I didn't want to lift my gen4 (aesthetic and handling reasons), would I gain any benefit (ride comfort etc) from swapping the OEM shocks with aftermarket ones? Would the shocks that came with a lift kit be usable, or are they paired specifically with the lifted springs?

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20 May 2020 12:08 #222567 by sniper
Replied by sniper on topic Swap shocks without a lift?
Shocks and springs are generally matched in ride height, using +50mm shocks on standard springs wouldn't be good. You would bottom out the shocks and damage them.

Going from oem shocks to a premium brand will bring positive results for an enthusiastic driver..... AVO's made a massive difference in mine but I do love a thrapse about on B roads...

If you just potter about, you'll probably not notice.

sniper
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20 May 2020 14:03 #222570 by zukebob
Replied by zukebob on topic Swap shocks without a lift?
Bilstein makes a standard length shock for the Gen 3. They are a good quality shock and may produce a stock length for your Gen 4 as well.

I started out with nothing & still have most of it left
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20 May 2020 14:05 #222572 by 300bhpton

sniper wrote: Shocks and springs are generally matched in ride height, using +50mm shocks on standard springs wouldn't be good. You would bottom out the shocks and damage them.

Unless you are moving the shock mounts, this isn't exactly correct. And I've not seen any (many) 4th Gen kits that do. Certainly the 50mm/2" kits do not move the shock mounting locations.

The only exception would maybe be kits that have extended bump stops, but the only way to be sure would be to know the closed shock length and if this length would exceed the capability of stock bump stops.

JB74W SZ5
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20 May 2020 14:12 - 20 May 2020 14:17 #222573 by 300bhpton

Gadget wrote: If I didn't want to lift my gen4 (aesthetic and handling reasons), would I gain any benefit (ride comfort etc) from swapping the OEM shocks with aftermarket ones? Would the shocks that came with a lift kit be usable, or are they paired specifically with the lifted springs?


This is a difficult question to answer accurately.

It is possible to alter the ride with different shocks. But unless you know all the specs (and some way to model them). It is likely impossible to say for certain if the ride will be unchanged, improve or diminish.

I suspect more likely is, it will alter a certain aspect of the ride, such as improve low speed ride, but make it worse at high speed impacts, or vice versa. Getting gains everywhere is usually quite a challenge and/or impossible.

Most factory setups are usually a mix of compromises, but a good safe middle ground.

Many lift kits (not all) will use longer shocks. As sniper says, there is the theoretical possibility of them bottoming out (under full flex off road or landing if you have been airborne, not likely for normal road use). But it would depend on a number of factors on if this is actually a potential issue.

The other issue is at the other end of the spectrum, if it is a longer shock when fully extended. It may cause your standard spring to be dislocated. Which may result in them not reseating correctly again. Although this is again only under full flex off road or if both wheels on the same axel are off the ground.

How much of a real problem this is on the Jimny I do not know as I haven't messed about taking the suspension apart yet.

Edited to add:

I suspect most replacement shock options will make damping more stiff. Certainly anything standard length, as normally people are wanting enhanced damping for towing, hauling or higher speeds. The lift kits also use different rate springs, but I do not know how the damping would compare.

One answer would be to buy some adjustable dampers. But you then need to be prepared to invest the effort and time messing about with them. And without the right experience and gear, it might actually be a lot harder than you think to get them setup to even match or better the standard setup.

Therefore trial and error is the only real option available. And as the vehicle is still fairly new, you will be pioneering this. :)

JB74W SZ5
Last edit: 20 May 2020 14:17 by 300bhpton.
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20 May 2020 14:19 - 20 May 2020 14:25 #222574 by DAGZOOK
Replied by DAGZOOK on topic Swap shocks without a lift?

300bhpton wrote:

sniper wrote: Shocks and springs are generally matched in ride height, using +50mm shocks on standard springs wouldn't be good. You would bottom out the shocks and damage them.

Unless you are moving the shock mounts, this isn't exactly correct. And I've not seen any (many) 4th Gen kits that do. Certainly the 50mm/2" kits do not move the shock mounting locations.

The only exception would maybe be kits that have extended bump stops, but the only way to be sure would be to know the closed shock length and if this length would exceed the capability of stock bump stops.


I think Sniper is correct, fitting 50mm+ longer shocks regardless of the compressed length to a JIM with standard height springs and brake lines is asking for trouble. The axles would be allowed to droop lower at full articulation, stretching brake lines and potentially allowing the springs to fall out? lol.

Gadget I've read really great things on this forum about AVO 16 stage adjustable dampers (OEM length) they're available from Jimny bits under the GEN.3 section. Bilstein also sell a set of OEM replacement B6 dampers for the Gen.3 - The fitment is identical according to fellow members on here. Someone bought some for their Gen.4 the other day, I saw it in the 'what did the postman bring today' thread :)

edit: This chap has bought the 50mm extended shocks - but they're available too in standard length :)

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Last edit: 20 May 2020 14:25 by DAGZOOK. Reason: Found the post in the aforementioned thread!
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20 May 2020 15:39 #222580 by Lambert
Replied by Lambert on topic Swap shocks without a lift?
I have trailmaster 0 to 20mm dampers on standard springs on Dreadnaught. They're awesome and offer a much more controlled ride than standard dampers in the spare Jimny. Mine are the sport valved ones not the comfort version. I would get them again for the spare Jimny as they make the ride like a normal car.

Dreadnaught (black 2011)
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20 May 2020 18:14 - 20 May 2020 18:15 #222597 by Scimike
Replied by Scimike on topic Swap shocks without a lift?
Hi
Unless your current dampers are faulty or worn-out (doubtful on a G4 at this time), I personally don't believe you will see any significant changes in the vehicle comfort or handling by just changing the dampers, irrespective of the brand you decide to fit. Things may be a little more apparent if you drive everywhere on the limit or with the vehicle loaded, but in the real world you won't notice much difference.
You can get adjustable dampers which will give you the ability to "tune" the damping for the road surface, but again they only tend to be useful at performance limits, in the real world you will just leave them on setting X for the majority of the time.
The bottom line is OEM dampers are good at what they do unless you race or trail your Jimny.

You could be spending £400+ on quality dampers only to find the ride comfort is not that different.

Good luck
Mike
Last edit: 20 May 2020 18:15 by Scimike.
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20 May 2020 20:04 #222602 by Lambert
Replied by Lambert on topic Swap shocks without a lift?
The difference between Dreadnaught and the spare Jimny in terms of ride is quite definite and in favour of Dreadnaught. The spare Jimny is a 2016 with 15k miles so not new new but still a very long way from tired. But it is soft to the point that it can start to make me feel a little ill if I'm not driving. Dreadnaught however is stable and will change direction at whatever legal speed I want without fuss or making me feel ill.

Dreadnaught (black 2011)
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20 May 2020 20:46 #222605 by 300bhpton

Lambert wrote: The difference between Dreadnaught and the spare Jimny in terms of ride is quite definite and in favour of Dreadnaught. The spare Jimny is a 2016 with 15k miles so not new new but still a very long way from tired. But it is soft to the point that it can start to make me feel a little ill if I'm not driving. Dreadnaught however is stable and will change direction at whatever legal speed I want without fuss or making me feel ill.

I’ve not been in a Gen3 for a while and not one as new as 2016. But the Gen 4 does not feel soft at all. Maybe Suzuki changed the damping and spring rates?

JB74W SZ5
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20 May 2020 22:35 #222616 by Gadget
Replied by Gadget on topic Swap shocks without a lift?
Thanks for all the input, useful stuff, will be keeping my cash for now :)

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