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BigJimnyMeet (North) 2024 (12 Jan 2024)
BigJimnyMeet 2024
14th July 2024
Parkwood Nr. Leeds
14th July 2024
Parkwood Nr. Leeds
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Auto Vs Manual for sand
- Postal
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01 Mar 2012 22:26 #34629
by Postal
Auto Vs Manual for sand was created by Postal
Hey all,
I live on the east coast of Australia and have access to some awesome sand islands and beaches that I want to go camping on. Looking around there really isnt a cheap 4x4 market (while also new and reliable) outside of the Zukes.
What I wanted to know is your thoughts on the auto for sand driving? Main reason I would like the auto is it will also be my work vehicle so I will be in traffic, also my partner does not drive manual so I would like something she can also drive. Now the car will only be used for sand driving, no rock hopping or extreme 4x4ing just normal sand driving/island exploring and maybe the occasional fire trail or other well graded dirt roads.
Will the auto box make the car far to underpowered in the sand?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
Postal
I live on the east coast of Australia and have access to some awesome sand islands and beaches that I want to go camping on. Looking around there really isnt a cheap 4x4 market (while also new and reliable) outside of the Zukes.
What I wanted to know is your thoughts on the auto for sand driving? Main reason I would like the auto is it will also be my work vehicle so I will be in traffic, also my partner does not drive manual so I would like something she can also drive. Now the car will only be used for sand driving, no rock hopping or extreme 4x4ing just normal sand driving/island exploring and maybe the occasional fire trail or other well graded dirt roads.
Will the auto box make the car far to underpowered in the sand?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
Postal
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02 Mar 2012 10:01 #34644
by kirkynut
The underdog often starts the fight, and occasionally the upper dog deserves to win - Edgar Watson Howe.
My Jimny Thread Here: www.bigjimny.com/index.php/forum/8-my-ji...on-continues?start=0
Replied by kirkynut on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
I would say that the progressive way the power is applied with an auto would suit sand well. The way it can behave like it's slipping the clutch will remove some of the power drainage issues slightly and to counteract this auto's have lower diff ratio's I believe - someone will correct me if I'm wrong.
My understanding of Jimny auto boxes is that they can get hot easily, so you would have to consider an oil cooler if they don't have one or maybe a larger one if they do.
Kirkynut
My understanding of Jimny auto boxes is that they can get hot easily, so you would have to consider an oil cooler if they don't have one or maybe a larger one if they do.
Kirkynut
The underdog often starts the fight, and occasionally the upper dog deserves to win - Edgar Watson Howe.
My Jimny Thread Here: www.bigjimny.com/index.php/forum/8-my-ji...on-continues?start=0
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- wanderinstar
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02 Mar 2012 10:08 #34645
by wanderinstar
Replied by wanderinstar on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
I have a question if you don;t mind Postal. As far as I know there are 2 types of auto.
!. The age old one with fluid flywheel and epicyclic gears.
2. The modern type that uses manual box and standard clutch. These are controlled by hydraulics and electronics. I have seen this on a Citroen C3 and they are also used on wagons. They return the same mpg as manuals.
Question is which type is on the Jimny.??
!. The age old one with fluid flywheel and epicyclic gears.
2. The modern type that uses manual box and standard clutch. These are controlled by hydraulics and electronics. I have seen this on a Citroen C3 and they are also used on wagons. They return the same mpg as manuals.
Question is which type is on the Jimny.??
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- darthloachie
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02 Mar 2012 12:02 #34654
by darthloachie
Replied by darthloachie on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
type 1
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- wanderinstar
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02 Mar 2012 12:05 #34655
by wanderinstar
Replied by wanderinstar on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
Thought they might be. That will make them even thirstier.
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02 Mar 2012 12:46 #34659
by Obarno
Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15
Replied by Obarno on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
I went to Fraser Island a couple of years ago and hired an auto Jimny whilst we were there. It had spent its entire life as a hire vehicle and had about 100,000 kms on the clock. It performed very well both on the long sand beaches and also on the softer inland sand. It was a vvt with the push button 4wd/low ratio and worked without problem. In the UK I also drive an auto jimny. On that I have fitted an additional oil cooler (they already have one in the bottom of the rad) from Think Automotive - Mocal - and would do the same if I were you particularly as East Coast summer temperatures can get quite high. When I bought my auto the gearbox oil was quite dirty and smelled slightly burnt. Not a good sign, but I drained the oil and fitted a new gearbox filter, and the previously mentioned oil cooler and now after about 10,000 miless the oil is still like new.
I think for sand driving an auto is good as it gives you seamless changes which in sand can make the difference between getting stuck or not.
Am I jealouse of what you are doing???!!! Have fun.
I think for sand driving an auto is good as it gives you seamless changes which in sand can make the difference between getting stuck or not.
Am I jealouse of what you are doing???!!! Have fun.
Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15
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03 Mar 2012 02:37 #34703
by kirkynut
The seamless gearchanges keeping the momentum must be a massive advantage!
Kirkynut
The underdog often starts the fight, and occasionally the upper dog deserves to win - Edgar Watson Howe.
My Jimny Thread Here: www.bigjimny.com/index.php/forum/8-my-ji...on-continues?start=0
Replied by kirkynut on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
Obarno wrote: I went to Fraser Island a couple of years ago and hired an auto Jimny whilst we were there. It had spent its entire life as a hire vehicle and had about 100,000 kms on the clock. It performed very well both on the long sand beaches and also on the softer inland sand. It was a vvt with the push button 4wd/low ratio and worked without problem. In the UK I also drive an auto jimny. On that I have fitted an additional oil cooler (they already have one in the bottom of the rad) from Think Automotive - Mocal - and would do the same if I were you particularly as East Coast summer temperatures can get quite high. When I bought my auto the gearbox oil was quite dirty and smelled slightly burnt. Not a good sign, but I drained the oil and fitted a new gearbox filter, and the previously mentioned oil cooler and now after about 10,000 miless the oil is still like new.
I think for sand driving an auto is good as it gives you seamless changes which in sand can make the difference between getting stuck or not.
Am I jealouse of what you are doing???!!! Have fun.
The seamless gearchanges keeping the momentum must be a massive advantage!
Kirkynut
The underdog often starts the fight, and occasionally the upper dog deserves to win - Edgar Watson Howe.
My Jimny Thread Here: www.bigjimny.com/index.php/forum/8-my-ji...on-continues?start=0
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- Postal
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04 Mar 2012 23:36 #34868
by Postal
Replied by Postal on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
Ahh great feedback Obarno, last time I was at Fraser around 20 years ago was in a 80 series TD manual LandCruiser, awesome memories of the place...just hope it hasnt changed too much? I hear you on the tranny cooler, appears this is a problem for many auto 4x4's especially in the soft sand. FItting an aftermarket oil cooler would be no problem and something I would do as a precaution.
Seems that finding a 2nd had Jim near me may prove hard so I might have to opt for a brand new one.
My partner is not sold on them yet, says they look embarrasing lol....she would prefer a Grand Vitara or something a little bigger. For the price I think they are both great cars.
Seems that finding a 2nd had Jim near me may prove hard so I might have to opt for a brand new one.
My partner is not sold on them yet, says they look embarrasing lol....she would prefer a Grand Vitara or something a little bigger. For the price I think they are both great cars.
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05 Mar 2012 10:59 #34902
by Obarno
Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15
Replied by Obarno on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
We had a great time there and drove pretty well the whole length of the east coast beach - quite amazing particularly when a light plane landed on the beach infront of us. They have priority!
There were some quite big washouts across the beach where streams flow across so a bit of care was needed but otherwise an incredible experience. Cant imagine that beach driving would ever be allowed in Europe, there would be a huge outcry.
As to choice of cars - a difficult one but I imagine either would do what you want.....................
There were some quite big washouts across the beach where streams flow across so a bit of care was needed but otherwise an incredible experience. Cant imagine that beach driving would ever be allowed in Europe, there would be a huge outcry.
As to choice of cars - a difficult one but I imagine either would do what you want.....................
Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15
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- X-Eng Simon
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05 Mar 2012 11:23 #34906
by X-Eng Simon
Replied by X-Eng Simon on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
Auto every time for me!
I've done a lot of driving in soft, beach sand - and an auto is 100% better than a manual.
The main reason for this is the sand saps a lot of power. If you are starting a hill climb, you rarely have enough power to cruise up in a single gear - even with a run up. If you try and change down in a manual you loose so much momentum that it just stops.
An auto can change seamlessly so it can give you speed at the bottom for the run-up then torque as you are climbing and slowing down.
In the same sand, the only manual I've driven which did as well as an Auto was a Td5 Land Rover which had an excess of power and torque and would just cruise up in low 3rd. Jimny's just don't have the same excess - but an Auto makes up much of the difference.
This is the place I'm talking about - and a fairly typical scene!
Si
I've done a lot of driving in soft, beach sand - and an auto is 100% better than a manual.
The main reason for this is the sand saps a lot of power. If you are starting a hill climb, you rarely have enough power to cruise up in a single gear - even with a run up. If you try and change down in a manual you loose so much momentum that it just stops.
An auto can change seamlessly so it can give you speed at the bottom for the run-up then torque as you are climbing and slowing down.
In the same sand, the only manual I've driven which did as well as an Auto was a Td5 Land Rover which had an excess of power and torque and would just cruise up in low 3rd. Jimny's just don't have the same excess - but an Auto makes up much of the difference.
Attachment France.jpg not found
This is the place I'm talking about - and a fairly typical scene!
Si
Attachments:
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05 Mar 2012 12:06 #34911
by Obarno
Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15
Replied by Obarno on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
Si - was that pic taken on the Milles Rivieres? Looks sort of familiar. If it is I know exactly what you mean about power sapping, but I did it in my 4ltr auto Wrangler without any problem. Like the TD5 loads of power and torque - (and diff locks)!
Manual VVT, 2 1/2" lift, ORA castor corrected arms, 2" ORA body lift, 4:1 transfer box, Uprated front shafts & CVs ERM , ARBs back & front 3.9 diffs, 6 point cage, ORA winch bumper - Superwinch EP9, ORA rear bumper, ORA axle truses, Diff guards ERM , TBR tank guard, Snorkel, Kumho KL71.30.9.50 15
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- X-Eng Simon
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05 Mar 2012 12:17 - 05 Mar 2012 12:21 #34912
by X-Eng Simon
Replied by X-Eng Simon on topic Re: Auto Vs Manual for sand
Parc du Marquenterre
A few times a year they allow 4x4's in to the park. It's all re-claimed beach and just huge!
A guide on a Quad takes you round the park which isn't as bad as it sounds as they know all the decent off road spots. As a group, we have been going pretty much every year for about 15 years - and I'm not bored of it yet!
Rhino Ray (Edwards) came with us one year with the very first Jimny I'd seen. We were all in Land Rovers and took the piss a bit - but even as standard it did pretty well. It must have rubbed off on me!
Si
A few times a year they allow 4x4's in to the park. It's all re-claimed beach and just huge!
A guide on a Quad takes you round the park which isn't as bad as it sounds as they know all the decent off road spots. As a group, we have been going pretty much every year for about 15 years - and I'm not bored of it yet!
Rhino Ray (Edwards) came with us one year with the very first Jimny I'd seen. We were all in Land Rovers and took the piss a bit - but even as standard it did pretty well. It must have rubbed off on me!
Si
Last edit: 05 Mar 2012 12:21 by X-Eng Simon.
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