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Guide Front Crank Oil Seal / Oil Pump Seal
- Russ-41
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05 Mar 2015 12:27 - 05 Mar 2015 14:20 #139931
by Russ-41
Guide Front Crank Oil Seal / Oil Pump Seal was created by Russ-41
This is for the G13BB engined jimnys - It may well be similar on the newer twin over head cam M13 versions but slightly harder. This isn't a difficult job, it's just a long one (half to a full day), give yourself the day, and make sure you don't need the Jimny the following day either, just in case.
You will need to remove the timing belt and it's pulley, and the oil sump.
See j999pre comments directly below as you don't have to go this far, you can leave the pump and sump on the car if you're happy that its not a gasket leaking ( I wasn't sure, I knew the sump leaked a bit anyway so it wasn't to hard of a decision to go all in, but it was a longer job than I expected)
You will need:
- A new rotary shaft oil seal (little sipes in it the wipe the shaft and hold oil back) I thought it was 32x47x6 , I bought one for £3 delivered! I had it to hand just in case I was right as it would save me ordering and waiting - it was indeed a perfect match so I could get straight on with the job!
- A tube of oil resistant silicone sealer.
-A means of holding the crank while you undo and tighten the crank timing pulley - as you'll see, I made something up quick.
- A good size drip tray or large piece of cardboard (or both!)
- Several cups of tea or coffee
Think you may want to consider:
- A new timing belt and tensioner - you'll be taking it all off any way
- Fresh oil + filter while your there (you'll be dropping the oil)
- Fresh radiator fluid, you may wish to flush the system, I wouldn't advise using a product, they can eat away at stuff, I had a bad experience with this about 10 years ago, engine out job, it was a Fiat though....)
So:
Loosen alternator belt completely and the power steering belt while your at it.
remove the fan - note the pulley is sandwiched between the flange and the fan, so it will want to drop off, remove that too.
Drain the water from the radiator via a white stud in the bottom corner of the rad, 1 to 2 turns on this not all the way out. Remove the top and bottom hose. The radiator is secured by just 2 bolts in the top right and left side, remove those and lift the rad out - now we can really see what we're doing and get hands and arms in etc.
As you can see above, I've removed the belts. Next step is to remove the lower belt pulley, 5 off 8m bolts secure this in place. My pulley needed a good knock from the handle of my hammer and it then wiggled off - it is used to balance the crank end and is located with a single roll pin, it must go back on in the same position and must not get damaged, thus don't try to use it to hold the crank when your undoing the timing pulley later on!!
The black plastic cam belt cover can now come off, one of the 10mm bolts is hidden behind the power steering pump belt tensioner bracket and is a little tricky, I managed it without removing the belt tensioner bracket.
Roughly align the cam shaft timing mark. Don't confuse the timing mark with the I and E position marks (Intake, Exhaust). I don't remember which mark is the right one, but I recall it being obvious plus its the one that lines up when the crank mark is also lined up - see picks. The casing at the top is notched, and there is an arrow on the casing for the lower pulley.
You now have a few choices. You now need to hold the crank so you can undo the nut that is securing the lower timing pulley. It is a normal thread about 120-130 Nm so fairly tight but nothing silly. I made a "stick" see pics. You could read further down to see that I removed the tin cover on the bell housing to access a few of the sump bolts - giving the opportunity to hold the flywheel somehow which is I think the proper approach.
So, using the belt pulley as a template I drilled a couple of tight fitting holes in this bit of hollow rectangle bar, it was JUST strong enough to hold when tightening back up, use it like a C spanner and let it wrap itself around, use it the other way and it will just tear like cardboard (if its cheap and horrible steel like mine) This was only about 300mm long.
and don't forget when sliding the pulley off, you're woodruff key will LEAP out if you let it.
Now comes the annoying bit, so near, and yet so far! The oil pump looks like it could be removed now, just take out the half dozen bolts from its face, and remove the 4 sump bolts - this would be rough and would mean a bit of splurged instant gasket seal is required when reassembling, and Suzuki clearly don't want people being rough! So 2 of the bolts, are not bolts, they're studs, so the WHOLE sump has to be removed.
To add to this, the rear sump bolts are hidden inside the gearbox, it's just a little tin plate held on by a 10mm stud at either side, but one of those 10mm studs was hidden by the clutch cable adjusting assembly - so..
Remove the black plastic cover in the side of the bell housing where the clutch cable lives, and loosen the clutch cable tensioner and pop the cable off. Then remove the tensioner assembly (2x 12mm bolts) and pull out the cable and tensioner (the tensioner will want to slide off the clutch cable I just put a cable tie round it to keep it neat, one less thing to fiddle back together. - finally, remove the 10mm bolts from the tin cover, remove the tin cover - perhaps take note:
Is there oil on the back of the flywheel (rear crank oil seal needs doing)
Is there excessive amounts of oil in the bell housing (gearbox oil seal needs doing)
So we can now finally access all the bolts holding the sump on, the oil dip stick is also best removed. - what a bloody game eh?
With the sump off, the pump can be removed with a bit of gentle wiggling and jiggling. It is located with 2 steel dowels on a couple of outer bolts, they will try to leap out and hide if your not paying attention. Also note when reassembling, the inner pump gear has 2 flats that mate with the flats on the crank, they must be aligned quite well when reassembling!
I took the opportunity to clean out the sump pickup while I was in there.
The gasket between the pump and engine was a steel one coated thinly in rubber - I scraped off the loose bits and cleaned it up with 1000 grit emery and smeared it on both sides with a little of the grey sump silicone on reassembly.
The oil seal was well worn and almost a flat profile inside. The crank shaft was slightly grooved and there was little to no room to fit the oil seal further in our further out so it didn't grind at the seal, if it wears out the seal before its time, I will sleeve the shaft (this can be done at home using a SKF speedi sleeve to coin a brand name, other brands are available and usually much cheaper!!) - If it lasts any less than a couple of years, I'll sleeve it (same goes for the rear diff pinion oil seal)
One of the hardest parts of the job was cleaning the gasket off the sump, which came off pretty easily, but rained down into the sump! I don't want ANY bits of silicone or anything making its way into one of the tiny oil ways It was rinsed out thoroughly, very thoroughly, there is a splash plate in the sump, so you can't get in to see or clean it out very well at all, its a bit of a nightmare.
I digress for a paragraph to highlight this issue. A car I bought from a friend about 3 years back died, its cam chewed into the head. Somehow when driving the oil filter got punctured, it was instantly spotted and turned off until it was resolved. However, A little bit of paper had made its way up the engine, into the exhaust cam bearing where it blocked the the oil flow, it wrote the head off - now I know the oil filter cleans anything as it goes up the pickup and before it goes into the engine, but I'd rather not take chances!
Cleaning the gasket faces on the bottom of the engine was a breeze, whoever did it (Suzuki) did it properly and coated it with oil - as did I. I use a 50/50 mix of paraffin and oil to clean the gasket surfaces. When the paraffin evaporates it leaves behind a thin film of oil which will prevent the silicone sticking to it. The sump was cleaned with thinners since I do want the gasket to stick to it. The oil pump housing and the face it bolts to were also oiled in the same way while cleaning (since we want the silicone to bind to the steel gasket and neither case)
Changing the oil seal took all of about 5 minutes, it pushes right in to the casing against a stop.
- proudly survey the scene of destruction around you and then then get busy with the silicone sealant on the pump and get that installed, then do the sump, and your away, start putting it all back together.
A few more pics, the new oil seal at the front is nice and angled, the old one at the back look angled in the photo, but is SO FLAT the light is reflecting off the BACK of the lip and not the front!
Nice and clean!
Sump, before/after cleaning. I use a Harris carbide scraper to clean these up (it was a bit pricey, £10-15 from a DIY store). The sharp edge has been carefully removed on a diamond stone and it makes this sort of job a breeze with little to no risk of gouging the casing due to the blade being about 4mm thick. It also has a nice fat rubber handle so its easy to get hold of.
Job done, let me know if I missed awt, or bits don't make sense!
Good luck!
You will need to remove the timing belt and it's pulley, and the oil sump.
See j999pre comments directly below as you don't have to go this far, you can leave the pump and sump on the car if you're happy that its not a gasket leaking ( I wasn't sure, I knew the sump leaked a bit anyway so it wasn't to hard of a decision to go all in, but it was a longer job than I expected)
You will need:
- A new rotary shaft oil seal (little sipes in it the wipe the shaft and hold oil back) I thought it was 32x47x6 , I bought one for £3 delivered! I had it to hand just in case I was right as it would save me ordering and waiting - it was indeed a perfect match so I could get straight on with the job!
- A tube of oil resistant silicone sealer.
-A means of holding the crank while you undo and tighten the crank timing pulley - as you'll see, I made something up quick.
- A good size drip tray or large piece of cardboard (or both!)
- Several cups of tea or coffee
Think you may want to consider:
- A new timing belt and tensioner - you'll be taking it all off any way
- Fresh oil + filter while your there (you'll be dropping the oil)
- Fresh radiator fluid, you may wish to flush the system, I wouldn't advise using a product, they can eat away at stuff, I had a bad experience with this about 10 years ago, engine out job, it was a Fiat though....)
So:
Loosen alternator belt completely and the power steering belt while your at it.
remove the fan - note the pulley is sandwiched between the flange and the fan, so it will want to drop off, remove that too.
Drain the water from the radiator via a white stud in the bottom corner of the rad, 1 to 2 turns on this not all the way out. Remove the top and bottom hose. The radiator is secured by just 2 bolts in the top right and left side, remove those and lift the rad out - now we can really see what we're doing and get hands and arms in etc.
As you can see above, I've removed the belts. Next step is to remove the lower belt pulley, 5 off 8m bolts secure this in place. My pulley needed a good knock from the handle of my hammer and it then wiggled off - it is used to balance the crank end and is located with a single roll pin, it must go back on in the same position and must not get damaged, thus don't try to use it to hold the crank when your undoing the timing pulley later on!!
The black plastic cam belt cover can now come off, one of the 10mm bolts is hidden behind the power steering pump belt tensioner bracket and is a little tricky, I managed it without removing the belt tensioner bracket.
Roughly align the cam shaft timing mark. Don't confuse the timing mark with the I and E position marks (Intake, Exhaust). I don't remember which mark is the right one, but I recall it being obvious plus its the one that lines up when the crank mark is also lined up - see picks. The casing at the top is notched, and there is an arrow on the casing for the lower pulley.
You now have a few choices. You now need to hold the crank so you can undo the nut that is securing the lower timing pulley. It is a normal thread about 120-130 Nm so fairly tight but nothing silly. I made a "stick" see pics. You could read further down to see that I removed the tin cover on the bell housing to access a few of the sump bolts - giving the opportunity to hold the flywheel somehow which is I think the proper approach.
So, using the belt pulley as a template I drilled a couple of tight fitting holes in this bit of hollow rectangle bar, it was JUST strong enough to hold when tightening back up, use it like a C spanner and let it wrap itself around, use it the other way and it will just tear like cardboard (if its cheap and horrible steel like mine) This was only about 300mm long.
and don't forget when sliding the pulley off, you're woodruff key will LEAP out if you let it.
Now comes the annoying bit, so near, and yet so far! The oil pump looks like it could be removed now, just take out the half dozen bolts from its face, and remove the 4 sump bolts - this would be rough and would mean a bit of splurged instant gasket seal is required when reassembling, and Suzuki clearly don't want people being rough! So 2 of the bolts, are not bolts, they're studs, so the WHOLE sump has to be removed.
To add to this, the rear sump bolts are hidden inside the gearbox, it's just a little tin plate held on by a 10mm stud at either side, but one of those 10mm studs was hidden by the clutch cable adjusting assembly - so..
Remove the black plastic cover in the side of the bell housing where the clutch cable lives, and loosen the clutch cable tensioner and pop the cable off. Then remove the tensioner assembly (2x 12mm bolts) and pull out the cable and tensioner (the tensioner will want to slide off the clutch cable I just put a cable tie round it to keep it neat, one less thing to fiddle back together. - finally, remove the 10mm bolts from the tin cover, remove the tin cover - perhaps take note:
Is there oil on the back of the flywheel (rear crank oil seal needs doing)
Is there excessive amounts of oil in the bell housing (gearbox oil seal needs doing)
So we can now finally access all the bolts holding the sump on, the oil dip stick is also best removed. - what a bloody game eh?
With the sump off, the pump can be removed with a bit of gentle wiggling and jiggling. It is located with 2 steel dowels on a couple of outer bolts, they will try to leap out and hide if your not paying attention. Also note when reassembling, the inner pump gear has 2 flats that mate with the flats on the crank, they must be aligned quite well when reassembling!
I took the opportunity to clean out the sump pickup while I was in there.
The gasket between the pump and engine was a steel one coated thinly in rubber - I scraped off the loose bits and cleaned it up with 1000 grit emery and smeared it on both sides with a little of the grey sump silicone on reassembly.
The oil seal was well worn and almost a flat profile inside. The crank shaft was slightly grooved and there was little to no room to fit the oil seal further in our further out so it didn't grind at the seal, if it wears out the seal before its time, I will sleeve the shaft (this can be done at home using a SKF speedi sleeve to coin a brand name, other brands are available and usually much cheaper!!) - If it lasts any less than a couple of years, I'll sleeve it (same goes for the rear diff pinion oil seal)
One of the hardest parts of the job was cleaning the gasket off the sump, which came off pretty easily, but rained down into the sump! I don't want ANY bits of silicone or anything making its way into one of the tiny oil ways It was rinsed out thoroughly, very thoroughly, there is a splash plate in the sump, so you can't get in to see or clean it out very well at all, its a bit of a nightmare.
I digress for a paragraph to highlight this issue. A car I bought from a friend about 3 years back died, its cam chewed into the head. Somehow when driving the oil filter got punctured, it was instantly spotted and turned off until it was resolved. However, A little bit of paper had made its way up the engine, into the exhaust cam bearing where it blocked the the oil flow, it wrote the head off - now I know the oil filter cleans anything as it goes up the pickup and before it goes into the engine, but I'd rather not take chances!
Cleaning the gasket faces on the bottom of the engine was a breeze, whoever did it (Suzuki) did it properly and coated it with oil - as did I. I use a 50/50 mix of paraffin and oil to clean the gasket surfaces. When the paraffin evaporates it leaves behind a thin film of oil which will prevent the silicone sticking to it. The sump was cleaned with thinners since I do want the gasket to stick to it. The oil pump housing and the face it bolts to were also oiled in the same way while cleaning (since we want the silicone to bind to the steel gasket and neither case)
Changing the oil seal took all of about 5 minutes, it pushes right in to the casing against a stop.
- proudly survey the scene of destruction around you and then then get busy with the silicone sealant on the pump and get that installed, then do the sump, and your away, start putting it all back together.
A few more pics, the new oil seal at the front is nice and angled, the old one at the back look angled in the photo, but is SO FLAT the light is reflecting off the BACK of the lip and not the front!
Nice and clean!
Sump, before/after cleaning. I use a Harris carbide scraper to clean these up (it was a bit pricey, £10-15 from a DIY store). The sharp edge has been carefully removed on a diamond stone and it makes this sort of job a breeze with little to no risk of gouging the casing due to the blade being about 4mm thick. It also has a nice fat rubber handle so its easy to get hold of.
Job done, let me know if I missed awt, or bits don't make sense!
Good luck!
Last edit: 05 Mar 2015 14:20 by Russ-41.
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05 Mar 2015 12:48 #139932
by j999pre
Gold Jimny the best colour (sold)
Big red Jimny 32" tyres, arbs, cage 5:1 transfer etc. (Sold)
Grey pick up Jimny
Turbo m13a, arbs, floating rear shafts, disc conversion rear, vented front conversion. 245 70 16. Winch, 3" lift, 4:16 trans hd shafts and CVS
Replied by j999pre on topic Guide Front Crank Oil Seal / Oil Pump Seal
Good guide Russ.
I didn't go as far as you and fitted the oil seal to the pump in situ. So I left the sump on.
I didn't go as far as you and fitted the oil seal to the pump in situ. So I left the sump on.
Gold Jimny the best colour (sold)
Big red Jimny 32" tyres, arbs, cage 5:1 transfer etc. (Sold)
Grey pick up Jimny
Turbo m13a, arbs, floating rear shafts, disc conversion rear, vented front conversion. 245 70 16. Winch, 3" lift, 4:16 trans hd shafts and CVS
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- Russ-41
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05 Mar 2015 13:41 - 05 Mar 2015 13:42 #139934
by Russ-41
Thanks!
And a very worthy point to any potentials :blink: perhaps if I knew what I was getting in to.....
I thought long and hard about it, as I couldn't see the seal when it began to leak, I didn't really know where it had come from although 90% sure, I thought it could have maybe just been the gasket or perhaps the gasket contributed, although unlikely to say the least. So I committed to taking the pump off.
I knew when I bought the car the only signs of oily damp were in fact around a few of the sump bolts, so when it transpired that it would have to be renewed along the way, I wasn't too bothered, one less thing to worry about - I like knowing everything is ship shape! :woohoo:
9 more control arm bushes and a which to fit, and then I'm going to keep my eye out for a cheap geabox so I can refurb the syncro on mine. I may even make a dual syncro out of the old and the new if there's space (by that I mean machining them down on a lathe, not fitting 2, just so no one gets the wrong end of the stick)
Replied by Russ-41 on topic Guide Front Crank Oil Seal / Oil Pump Seal
j999pre wrote: Good guide Russ.
I didn't go as far as you and fitted the oil seal to the pump in situ. So I left the sump on.
Thanks!
And a very worthy point to any potentials :blink: perhaps if I knew what I was getting in to.....
I thought long and hard about it, as I couldn't see the seal when it began to leak, I didn't really know where it had come from although 90% sure, I thought it could have maybe just been the gasket or perhaps the gasket contributed, although unlikely to say the least. So I committed to taking the pump off.
I knew when I bought the car the only signs of oily damp were in fact around a few of the sump bolts, so when it transpired that it would have to be renewed along the way, I wasn't too bothered, one less thing to worry about - I like knowing everything is ship shape! :woohoo:
9 more control arm bushes and a which to fit, and then I'm going to keep my eye out for a cheap geabox so I can refurb the syncro on mine. I may even make a dual syncro out of the old and the new if there's space (by that I mean machining them down on a lathe, not fitting 2, just so no one gets the wrong end of the stick)
Last edit: 05 Mar 2015 13:42 by Russ-41.
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- Tadpole
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05 Mar 2015 19:36 #139962
by Tadpole
Replied by Tadpole on topic Guide Front Crank Oil Seal / Oil Pump Seal
Great write up & pics Russ, thanks for taking the time, I feel another sticky coming on .............. 
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- Russ-41
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06 Mar 2015 14:11 #139995
by Russ-41
Replied by Russ-41 on topic Guide Front Crank Oil Seal / Oil Pump Seal
Thanks very much, I did it a few weeks ago so I hopefully I haven't forgotten anything
Maybe we could do with a categorised guides section for members guides/tips - locked so no one can put things in to it. Sub folders to navigate to different areas quickly. This might be a bit easier than searching which can be a bit hit and miss! It should mature well over time, keep the technical thread for, well technical info and questions I guess.
sub folders like,
Jimny/Mechanical/Engine/G13
Jimny/Electrical/Engine/M13
Jimny/Suspension
Jimny/Aftermarket Upgrade
and so on?? Just a thought.
Even if it's just a simple thing like changing a sensor, perhaps just a collation of info and symptoms along with the steps to test or change it.
Maybe we could do with a categorised guides section for members guides/tips - locked so no one can put things in to it. Sub folders to navigate to different areas quickly. This might be a bit easier than searching which can be a bit hit and miss! It should mature well over time, keep the technical thread for, well technical info and questions I guess.
sub folders like,
Jimny/Mechanical/Engine/G13
Jimny/Electrical/Engine/M13
Jimny/Suspension
Jimny/Aftermarket Upgrade
and so on?? Just a thought.
Even if it's just a simple thing like changing a sensor, perhaps just a collation of info and symptoms along with the steps to test or change it.
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- chewy93
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