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Re:Gen 4 Battery swap

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12 Aug 2020 08:36 - 12 Aug 2020 08:57 #226544 by GeorgeC
Replied by GeorgeC on topic Gen 4 Battery swap
Lambert, it can be done by the Suzuki Method, as above, then you re-program all the things that drop out. Or, you can do what the battery suppliers do and provide a back up.

However, there are different local solutions in different places. Some remove and bench charge once a month. I top-up with solar once a week. Others have a Lithium Battery under the passenger seat and a DC/DC Converter to keep the starting battery up. All this because someone in Brussels decided Australia can't use the hi-output Alternator cause it makes too much CO2 for Europe! The Alternator produces 80Amp max and 60A+ at 1050rpm! But little of that current makes it to the battery.

If you read the Forum Topic "Tonka's poorly", you can see just how mean the computer can be if it thinks you have had enough Amps for that drive!

The Battery bloke also said the new Ford Ranger is just the same as the new Suzukis!
Last edit: 12 Aug 2020 08:57 by GeorgeC. Reason: + Ford Ranger!

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12 Aug 2020 11:18 #226549 by Gadget
Replied by Gadget on topic Gen 4 Battery swap

Lambert wrote: Sorry I'm confused. Are you saying that on a gen4 you can't just disconnect the battery without a supplementary 12v supply or a trip to the dealer to get them to do it and or recode the car? That's mental if that's the case.


I think the need for a supplementary feed is only if you want to keep any logged fault codes in the system, the manual mentions disconnecting the battery if you're not using the car for a while - unlikely they'd say that if you had to take it to the dealer to get everyting working again (I hope!) :)
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22 Aug 2020 05:06 #227145 by GeorgeC
Replied by GeorgeC on topic Gen 4 Battery swap
All done!
Battery swapped, Car Serviced, new 0W-20 Oil.
Codes scanned, one Fault Code found, in hand with the Service Manager.
Today's Battery Resting Voltage is 12.73V, that is with just the Alternator re-changing the battery.
Now it just gets better! :)

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30 Aug 2020 20:10 - 30 Aug 2020 20:15 #227568 by GeorgeC
Replied by GeorgeC on topic Gen 4 Battery swap
My Joy was short lived, the Alternator was 'switched off' on the next drive! Suzuki sent the RAC Man on Saturday to switch the Alternator back on. :)

I am now looking for a lo-voltage alarm. I want to use in the 12V Accessory Socket to power it and set to 12.6Volts and to go off when the alternator is switched off. I can then stop and re-boot the car and the charging system and continue my drive.

Something simple please, a piezzo buzzer with a small switching circuit. I don't need any more computers or visual devices. I only have one eye and limited vision so an audible alarm is much better for me. I have asked on two Facebook Forums, no success. 40 years back I sold these things for boats and trucks.

thank you, George
Last edit: 30 Aug 2020 20:15 by GeorgeC.

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31 Aug 2020 08:38 #227580 by mlines
Replied by mlines on topic Re:Gen 4 Battery swap
How do you turn the alternator off and on?

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

Martin

2003 M13 early KAP build.
3" Trailmaster lift with 1.5 Spacers on front
Customised winch bumper and roll cage
235/85R16 Maxxis Bighorns on 16" Rims, 4:1 Rocklobster, Rear ARB locker and on-board air
Corrected arms all-round, rear disks, Recaro seats and harnesses

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31 Aug 2020 09:27 - 31 Aug 2020 21:40 #227582 by GeorgeC
Replied by GeorgeC on topic Re:Gen 4 Battery swap

mlines wrote: How do you turn the alternator off and on?

Hey that's my question! I've PM'd the latest 'fix'. Four hours after shopping, the battery resting voltage is 12.73V! :woohoo:

Thank you for the help with the search, this one looks to be the goods! There is a video in the link.
www.mpja.com/Battery-Low-Voltage-Alarm/productinfo/35716%20MP/
or here:
www.aliexpress.com/item/32859037056.html...0_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
Last edit: 31 Aug 2020 21:40 by GeorgeC. Reason: The Video

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01 Sep 2020 01:36 - 01 Sep 2020 01:38 #227614 by Andy2640
Replied by Andy2640 on topic Re:Gen 4 Battery swap
This all seems a bit quackers to me!

Ive had the battery out multipul times, and ive had no problems. My electrical system works just fine, and im running a winch off the stock battery. I have a bluetooth battery monitor with an app, and cranking voltage, resting voltage is all sweet. Battery is a bit small and runs down quick if leaving aircon on without engine running but all good.

So whats the fuss about having to go to a dealer if the battery is disconnected?
.

A wise man once said...... When we are Mean, Shout at People, Lose our Tempers, Swear, and generally act like Tool Bags, Never forget ..... We are all Cavemen in Suits, Uniforms and/or Overalls ..... Living in Semi-Concrete Jungles. Andy - 2019 AD.
Last edit: 01 Sep 2020 01:38 by Andy2640.
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01 Sep 2020 16:17 - 01 Sep 2020 16:18 #227627 by mlines
Replied by mlines on topic Re:Gen 4 Battery swap
George appears to have an electrical load management issue possibly due to a wiring fault (earth) combined with his driving profile.

He makes very short trips with full electrical and electro-mechanical (aircon) load. Perth Australia is hot!

The vehicle appears to react to this load by commanding the alternator to reduce volts to lighten the load on the engine, this is the normal function of the LIM circuit on the alternator.

As the journey is short, the battery never gets charged and eventually discharges completely.

As no-one else reports this, there is likely to be some sort of fault that encourages the load sensing on the battery to limit the alternator more than it does on other Jimnys

The interim "cure" is to press the OFF button on the AirCon that disengages the aircon compressor clutch. This reduces the engine load and allows the alternator to start charging the battery as the engine can now provide the energy.

This is what George means by turning the alternator on/off, he is referring to the aircon clutch which has this effect.

Martin

Martin

2003 M13 early KAP build.
3" Trailmaster lift with 1.5 Spacers on front
Customised winch bumper and roll cage
235/85R16 Maxxis Bighorns on 16" Rims, 4:1 Rocklobster, Rear ARB locker and on-board air
Corrected arms all-round, rear disks, Recaro seats and harnesses
Last edit: 01 Sep 2020 16:18 by mlines.
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01 Sep 2020 17:14 #227629 by Grima
Replied by Grima on topic Re:Gen 4 Battery swap
Last Nov Jimny landed.
4.5 miles to work, total 9 miles per day on 30mph roads if your lucky.
6 sets of lights so its slow going.
Lights on auto plus aircon on all the time.
10 months later my battery is fine.
Just opened car door the battery read 12.5v with no key in the ignition.
Hope this helps.

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01 Sep 2020 18:21 - 01 Sep 2020 20:30 #227630 by GeorgeC
Replied by GeorgeC on topic Re:Gen 4 Battery swap
Thank you for all your replies!!! :)

Andy you really have a Blessed car! I'll PM you later with a suggestion for an improved battery, I still need to check if it is available in the UK.

Martin, thank you for responding to Andy, and explaining my situation in a way that UK readers will understand. Yes the "OFF" button has become the on/off switch for the alternator and is now a get-me-home button!

Grima, in that scenario, 12.5V is fine.

My Saturday Morning technique for checking the Battery Resting Voltage is:
Un-lock with the key, pull bonnet release, re-lock with the key. Store the key more than 30 feet from car and not in your pocket.
3-4 hours later, with the car still locked, lift the bonnet and check the Battery Resting Voltage.
Ideally, it should be between 12.7 and 12.8 volts. If so, close the bonnet and make a cup of tea!

If below 12.6V, I will float the solar panel across the battery for the rest of the day, bringing the terminal voltage up to around 13 volts.
The car remains locked and the key inside the house. I have been doing this since April last year and now have four pages of records!

This method usually gives me enough battery power to go shopping on the next Monday.

The new "fix", using the "OFF" switch, may reduce the need for extra charging. I will know on Saturday as this is the first week of trying this method.

I hope that helps a little.
Last edit: 01 Sep 2020 20:30 by GeorgeC.
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01 Sep 2020 22:08 #227632 by RainerK
Replied by RainerK on topic Re:Gen 4 Battery swap
What also might help might be switching to LiFePo4 battery. They have a higher efficiency and therefore make more use of charging. I have been using one for my motorbike now for 3 years and did never have to recharge. With a lead acid battery I had to recharge at least twice a year.

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04 Sep 2020 09:47 - 04 Sep 2020 20:26 #227706 by GeorgeC
Replied by GeorgeC on topic Re:Gen 4 Battery swap
Firstly, I'll address Rainer's well meaning suggestion. Thank you.

Most Batteries that will fit in the space provided are NOT Plug-and-Play with the Gen4 Smart Alternator.
This is one reason for this topic, removing one that did not Play!

I am constantly searching for compatible replacements and upgrades that have been field tested in the car and also meet the EU emission requirements.

We have the #2138, a Sealed Calcium here in Australia. It is supplied by Club Assist through RAC/NRMA outlets. This is considered a replacement and not an upgrade

Another from Germany is the VARTA 545 155 033. This also is considered a replacement and not an upgrade!

Remember these have been field tested and meet the requirements of the EU using the Smart Alternator.

Moving on:
Today I contacted Suzuki Roadside Assist to see what the next logical step would be following the RAC Man's visit. To my amazement I have been allocated A Free Tow to my Selling Dealer! I checked this with Suzuki Customer Service and the Dealer and yes its there for me to take advantage of, any time I wish! In the discussion process it quickly became apparent that this is the repair of last resort! After careful consideration, I don't wish to repeat the errors of the past, PDI and Accessory fails! There must be a better way to have the car fixed! If the RAC Man can come to my home and diagnose the fault, then why can't Suzuki do the same?

Meanwhile, its Battery Day later today, I'll check the Resting Voltage and see if the RAC Man's temporary fix has worked!
Last edit: 04 Sep 2020 20:26 by GeorgeC.

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